Bob Rozak.com

[Mrs S Black]

Wow! Some theories were right and others were wrong...I am satisfied with the happy ending, but did I miss it telling us what everyone did for a living? Who was the headmaster? Argh, My oldest is now reading the book, I can't go look it up...

[shammy]

I know! I wish there was more about their professions... and the other Weasleys...
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"Life is like a jar of jalapeños. What you do today, might burn your ass tomorrow."

[Mrs S Black]

Like she thought we would not care to know that bit of information...I thought he was dead for sure! I wish I knew what happened to the left death eaters...other than Draco anyway...


Snape was good...and LOVES Harry?!?!?! He had a funny way of showing it to Harry though...during his class...Was Percy a teacher?

[shammy]

They don't say...

I wish she explained more about the flask in his death scene... To me it seemed like this book got heavily edited. Wasn't there supposed to be 784 pages???

Mrs. Weasley ROCKED with Bellatrix... That was great...
Neville totally kicked butt too!!!

I really thought it would be Draco teaching potions... JKR said it would be the person we least expect, but I could see Neville teaching Herbology... Also in one of Harry's dreams in SS, Snape's image turned into Draco's...
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"Life is like a jar of jalapeños. What you do today, might burn your ass tomorrow."

[Aleatha Ingleton]

What do you mean Snape loves Harry? Did I miss something?

Girls girls girls... Snape was in love with Lily Evans. He hated James Potter and he hated Harry because Harry was just like his father. The ONLY reason Snape helped protect Harry all these years was because he felt he owed it to Lily. Because of him Lily was murdered by Voldemort and Snape was never able to fully forgive himself for that. He was obsessed with Lily.

What I cannot reconcile is how JUST because Snape was obsessed with Lily Potter and his own betrayel of her, why that suddenly excuses ALL the bad things he ever did- all the ill treatment of the students in his care. I thought the epilogue was extremely bad- VAST overkill. I cried at the end of the book more out of frustration than anything else. I just felt like the book was way too rushed and that many things were resolved quickly and poorly or not at all.


And I'm so sad about Fred Weasley...


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I miss Bob

[Mrs S Black]

Yea and FRED!!! They didn't even tell us what happens with George, she really only cleared up the main 3, but even then, way to vague...I re read the last bit there...yep they have kids, what do they do!!!!

*grits teeth*

In the pensieve Snape was asked if he loved Harry, he said more than you know, or something like that...he was still an ass, yep

glad the spiders didn't eat Hagrid

she needs to do a real epilogue instead of a scene 19 years in the future at kings cross...

[Aleatha Ingleton]

I don't remember that AT ALL. The only person I recall him saying he loved was Lily.

And I can't go re-read right now because I leant my book to a girl at work who's dying for it. She read the first third during breaks at work today. I'll probably have the book back by Tuesday at the latest.
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I miss Bob

[Mrs S Black]

We can't remember every single little thing the first time through anyway! Especially during a sequence that is partly a repeat from the other books...made me want to skim *shruggs*

[Miaka]

[shammy]

But ladies... Didn't the hopeless romantic in you just melt when he died looking into Lily's eyes???

Awwwwwwwwwwwwwwww

Snape; my lovely little obsessive Capricorn!!! He did care about Harry... whether it was out of remorse or what have you. He was complaining to Dumbledore about why he was protecting Harry all these years... felt like he was misled in signing up for what he did. To me that showed he cared!

I liked the book, and I also thought the epilogue was short. But you know what? It didn't need to be longer! She really summed it up in her last three words... "All was well." There was no need to elaborate on anything else. True, I will agree that it would have been nice to know about the others, but that is what she probably meant by saying "Never another Harry Potter book..."
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"Life is like a jar of jalapeños. What you do today, might burn your ass tomorrow."

[Miaka]

I am a sucker for unrequited love, and the Snape part was one of my favorite parts in the book

I am not saying he should be excused for all of his jerkiness (is that a word?) but I would say being bitter and living your life with unrequited love, and the guild associated with the person you loved dying while there is nothing you can do can make ya a bit jaded.

[shammy]

Well, he feels guilty... He did cause Lily's death in essence.

Snape never struck me as the type whose worst memory would be James/Sirius making fun of him... He is above all that in the sense that no matter how terrible people treat him, he will not let it bother him. In the greater scheme of things that didn't matter! I just KNEW there was more to the story!

Calling Lily a mudblood was the worst thing he ever did... if you notice, he didn't even allow Phineas to say it 21 years later. He truly regretted it and felt remorse.

Side note... Didn't you think it was cool how Lily's patronus was a doe and James' was a stag???

And doesn't that comment about Dumbledore doing things with a wand the OWL examiner had never seen before make sense???
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"Life is like a jar of jalapeños. What you do today, might burn your ass tomorrow."

[Aleatha Ingleton]

There is no "Hopeless romantic" in me. I thought the whole Snape/Lily thing was the biggest disappointment in the book. It made the book feel like a fanfiction and I never thought I'd say that. There is nothing romantic about unrequited love- especially not the sort that leads a man to abuse and murder. I'm sorry but Snape's feelings for Lily Potter do NOT excuse his joining of Voldemort's crowd to begin with NOR do they excuse his treatment of Harry through the years. There was NO affection of love for Harry. I thought that was abundently clear. Everything he did, he did because of Lily and the GUILT he felt because of his hand in her death. But even his guilt wasn't enough to allow him to treat Harry fairly or kindly.

Also keep in mind that the ONLY REASON Snape did what he DID for Harry is because Dumbledore essentially emotionally blackmailed him into it.

His anger when it seemed Dumbledore had been raising Harry for slaughter was NOT for Harry's sake, but because he felt he'd been used. The whole point of everything he'd done had been because of a commitment to preserve the life of Lily's child- the child he hated, but whom he felt obliged to for LILY'S sake. Lily died for Harry so for HER sake Snape would do the same.

I thought, to be entirely frank, that the entire thing was beyond TRITE.
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I miss Bob

[Miaka]

The semi problem with the Snape background was that there were still gaping holes.

Snape became a DE before Lily and James's death, that much we do know. I think in essence, Snape was a lonely person. The only people who really associated with him were the Slytherin people, and it seems natural that a lot of them went on the become DE. So, Snape just ran with the crowd, as far as I can tell. He didn't get the girl, but I never thought he was inherently evil.

Justification, no. Hell, I was never a huge Snape fan to begin with. I always thought he was mean and pretty one dimensional as far as characters go. I did like though that in this book she gave Snape a softer side, just like I liked how she gave Dumbledore a not-so-clean side.

If there was one thing that made me sad in the book, it was the epilogue. I truely do wish there could have been a bit more in there.

[shammy]

I didn't feel that way at all... That whole scene just explained so much.

He was the 'awful boy' Petunia spoke about coming home with Lily!!! Sneaky Sneaky JKR... letting us think it was James!!!

The Lily thing was the turning point in his life... It is rather sad... had things gone differently, Harry might have been Snape's son!!! They were friends... TRUE friends until that point. They had known each other for quite some time and really learned so much about themselves walking together through all those milestones. Snape had told Lily everything about Hogwarts and they shared that journey through most of school. What are the chances that he was the one right there that day at the playground? He just knew she was a witch and helped her learn as much about that world as he could!

I think it is very important that we remember Snape said it made no difference if you were pure blood or not that day on the playground. Lily must have known he was not pureblood, and it doesn't really appear as if anyone really knew about that. His comments in the Headmasters office reinforce that it was really how he felt.

Don't get me wrong... Snape was wrong... SOOOOOO wrong for telling Voldemort about the prophecy. But he didn't realize that it could be about the Potters at that point. He did make an effort to correct the situation before they died. I mean, he did want to save the woman he loved, but still... he told Dumbledore about it to save her... all of them. This all happened before Voldemort's downfall. He had no way of knowing who it was about.

Had the kid in the prophecy really been Neville, you can be sure that he wouldn't have taken that information to Dumbledore. But this shows that his love for her was stronger than anything else. That might have been what made LV choose Harry as well... If Snape thought Harry could be the chosen one, it must be, right???

To me, in the end Snape had to be "bad" to pull off the ruse, and that is the way I've always felt... Blackmail or not, Snape still did it. He probably hated every second of seeing Harry (looking into those eyes probably killed him too!) But he did it! The love that saved Harry as a baby was just as strong as the one that saved him in the end!
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"Life is like a jar of jalapeños. What you do today, might burn your ass tomorrow."

[Aleatha Ingleton]

I'm sorry but the fact that Snape would not have bothered to turn himself in as a Death Eater if it had been someone OTHER than Lily in danger just proves my point that Snape was NOT a good person. Only because the ONE woman he was fixated on was in danger did he turn himself over. It wasn't because he was good- it was because he was in danger of losing something personal.

But romanticize him if you want. I still maintain my utter disgust and disappointment.
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I miss Bob

[BoB]

Can't say I'm too thrilled about Snape either, I'd hoped he was going to be revealed as really good- that is, I thought Dumbledore believed Snape was a changed man, but it turns out he wasn't, and Dumbledore new it. Snape was acting for Snape; trying to hold on to the one thing he ever really cared about.

This makes him at least as bad a human as the Malfoys.

They too, remember, showed a true love for each other. They acted upon that love even when it went against Voldemort. But in the end, are we okay with that? Are they forgiven for their crimes because we know they can love, and choose to put that first?

Of course not. They were bad people and they still are. Perhaps this experience has changed them a bit, Draco in particular, but do you think Lucius and Narcissa are likely to change their views on the importance of blood purity? Of course not!

You see, they are good to each other, and no one else. That is as far as love has taken them.

Now consider what Snape would have done had he survived. Lily's son is safe, saved from the terrible wizard who tried so hard to kill him. He has done what he set out to do.

His job on the good side would have been over, and that'd be that. Snape still shows strong evil tendencies in every aspect of his life where Lily is not concerned.

Deathly Hallows revealed the Snape answer as only this: Snape was fighting on the good side all along.

But the question of "Snape: good or evil?" can only be concluded that Snape was not good.

Consider that even though he loved Lily, he did not heed her words. She told him he was going down the wrong path. He still went down the wrong path. He did not change course until it affected him personally. He sought relief from guilt, not redemption!

So having helped keep Lily's son safe from the man he himself had inadvertently set upon Harry, Snape could've lived guilt-free from then on. But doing what? Volunteering at soup kitchens?

Hell no. Snape never changed who he was. He never stopped taking pleasure in torturing the students he disliked. Is that so far from using the Cruciatus Curse on your enemies? Had he survived, he would not have continued on to become a smiling, kind headmaster who really did like all his students after all. He'd still be a sneering, unfair jerk who finds a sick pleasure in making other people suffer.

Snape was good to Lily, and no one else.

Innocent during his time with Dumbledore? Yes. Good? No.

[Pottersgrlstl]

Snape has never been one of my favorite characters, but it's going a bit far to call him one dimensional. I would say the opposite is true and is why he has always had such a huge fan following. I liked the Prince's Tale chapter again it's going a bit far to say it's fanfic. It makes sense that he protected Harry for all those years based on guilt. It was rather disgusting of him to only care that Lily survive. I never thought he was going to be the shinning hero, but he did risk his life trying to protect Harry even if was only out of guilt.
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[shammy]

I'm sorry, but I LOVE Snape! I always have... I think he is a great character that could have been taken so many different places in the series. This is the one JKR chose and I am not necessarily upset with it.

We learned there was more to Dumbledore's character, (he wasn't perfect) and we have also learned that there is more to Snape (than just being an unfeeling DE.) I think that is the point of the story though, don't you think? There is more than just what you see... Just like Dumbledore said to Snape... sometimes he thinks they sort too soon...

You have to realize he was maybe 15 at the time his "worst memory" happened... I'm sure a lot could have changed between 5th year and 7th year. He was a STUPID kid that made a terrible mistake... He had a lot of growing up to do to start with and to top it off, he lost his best friend... If there was one thing to push him over the edge either way, that would have been it.

I am not saying Lily's presence would have made him a changed man... Obviously her influence for 5+ years had some effect on him though if he is still so very much in love with her. It wasn't enough to stop him from going that route in the first place, but he was at a crossroads in his life and those events helped him make that decision.

Look at The Harry/Ron/Hermione situation... Ron truly believed that Harry liked Hermione and that she reciprocated those feelings... He believed this so much it made him leave them in the forest... I'm not surprised that Snape called Lily a mudblood... He knew James liked her... he was jealous. He truly regretted calling her that he came back to make good on his mistake (just like Ron.)

It's not even a matter of him being good or bad... He showed remorse... That is the one thing that put him heads above the rest of the DE's in my book. Like they said before... the world is not separated between good people and Death Eaters... He really is the one they kept eluding to when they said this.

About the Malfoys... I don't fault Draco one bit... He did not ask for the family he was born into. I feel Narcissa is going along with what Lucius says... She in the end sort of helped Harry too... She could easily have said "No my Lord- He is not dead!" and that would have changed everything.
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"Life is like a jar of jalapeños. What you do today, might burn your ass tomorrow."

[Aleatha Ingleton]

BoB!!! At last someone who doesn't think I'm delusional and "unable to accept defeat" because I still think Snape was a mean and nasty person in spite of his final sacrifice!

I agree with you %100 about Snape's overall character and movtives!

And I'm glad you finally made it here. I was afraid you may have gone and burnt your books after reading it- the silence from your end of things has been ominous. :S
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I miss Bob

[shammy]

I had a chance to reread the Prince's tale again last night. I've come to the conclusion that JKRs comments about what is 'right' and 'easy' are meant for Snape just as much as (if not more than) Harry.

Snape is really the one with the decision that needed to be made, not Harry. In my mind there was never any doubt what Harry would do- he never wavered one bit. Harry is predictable- he approached Snape on his deathbed... he did not let him die alone when he could have. This is what we expect from Harry and we got it. All those hurtful angry feelings were put aside for a moment. Had he not done that, Harry would not have been able to retrieve the memories and learn what he needed to do.

It would have been too easy for Snape to disgrace Dumbledore and let him die at the hand of another DE, but he showed mercy. He did not have to do that for Dumbledore... it was COMPLETELY independent of him helping Harry. If he wanted to be that selfish and unfeeling, he would have just helped Harry out of guilt... live upto his end of the bargain with Dumbledore- in turn facing his demons for his role in getting Lily killed. Yet he chose mercy...

Some will argue that Snape killing Dumbledore meant that that he really wanted to do it... And he did! Like Leslie said, it was emotional blackmail. Regardless of Dumbledore using this against him though, he was torn up inside as a result of what he had done.

We are led to believe that Snape is this tortured soul... This chapter shows us he knows what is right... It may conflict with the agenda of those around him, but he knows. This is what puts Snape above all the other DE's... This is what makes him better than the Malfoys and the Carrows.

It is not even a matter of forgiving him. We don't have to.... Harry does, and he did! Snape had to live those 17 years knowing what he did. Just like Dumbledore said... "reveal the best of you." We got to see the real Snape... at his best and at his worst in that chapter.
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"Life is like a jar of jalapeños. What you do today, might burn your ass tomorrow."

[shammy]

One thing I must add about Snape...

In the "Seven Potters" chapter, Snape really tried to blast the other DE and not George... he hit him by mistake. In a way he was still protecting "the students." Another thing he didn't have to do to keep his promise to Dumbledore where Harry was concerned.
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"Life is like a jar of jalapeños. What you do today, might burn your ass tomorrow."

[Pottersgrlstl]

Shammy look what I found.


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[Aleatha Ingleton]

[shammy]

That is true! But it was Snape's idea... Too bad he didn't tell Dung which one to place the real Harry with...

I will resolve that Snape made all the right decisions for all the wrong reasons... I think we can agree to that.
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"Life is like a jar of jalapeños. What you do today, might burn your ass tomorrow."

[Pottersgrlstl]

I know a lot of people have reread book seven several times by now, but I'm still in the middle of my first reread. I already know what happens so I don't have that sense of urgency and it was emotionally draining the first time around. Anyway I just finished chapter seventeen, Bathilda's Secret. In the previous chapter Harry is bitten by Nagini and Hermione just puts some dittany on his wound. I thought that the snake had venom that prevents wounds from healing. Is it because he is a horcrux that he is able to heal better than Mr. Weasley when bitten?
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[shammy]

Hmmm... could be... That is a good point.

Somehow, I think Mr. Weasley's injuries were worse... afterall, she was planning on killing him off! Harry's didn't seem like they were as bad.

I think you are onto something though with the fact that he is a horcrux. Makes no sense to have them if you horcruxes can kill each other.
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"Life is like a jar of jalapeños. What you do today, might burn your ass tomorrow."

[Pottersgrlstl]

You're right Mr. Weasley was much worse. Nagini was just supposed to hold Harry until Voldemort arrived. It was interesting having three horcruxes in one room at the same time. The locket seemed to beat wilder when in the presence of Nagini even burning Harry.
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[shammy]

That's wild! Three horcruxes in one room... It's almost as if they all were acting funny...

Maybe horcruxes try to right themselves somehow; Wanting to be whole again?!? Hmmm something to think about.
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"Life is like a jar of jalapeños. What you do today, might burn your ass tomorrow."